Nice..... +++

But Tesla are now getting some bad press:

http://mashable.com/2015/10/28/tesla-hype/#6DcAKwsVJgq.

Avoid the used RWD ones though, best get a AWD version.
I more or less decided my next car would be a used Model S, but researching more about them the drivetrain replacements kept popping up as a real issue.
I understand a lot of these are replaced proactively, and the % of replacements out of the whole population is probably small, too small even for Consumer Report threshold for registering a problem. But to me its alarming to see even a small number of replacements of (what should be) an essentially maintenance free drivetrain.
The whole point of electric motor and single speed transmission is that it is supposed to be ultra reliable, rugged and long lived compared to a internal combustion engine. So few moving parts, etc. But it appears the motor torque is just too much for a single speed gearbox and rear wheel drive. Real shame. I was hoping they solved this after the difficulties with the roadster 2-speed transmission chewing gears.
Once out of warranty this is not a problem I would want to face.

http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/showt...nt-Poll/page12

http://www.greencarreports.com/news/...-big-a-problem

http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/showt...or-replacement

Goran, D2 is the best car ever built. Forget tesla.

+++
I need reminding, and the faults of these other cars help me remember. :)

The Model S is the future, the '8 is the past (but a very nice one).

Here's a good, very concise, and readable article on why:

http://qz.com/529428/have-tesla-and-...-of-no-return/

I read an article earlier today about the concept Lexus hydrogen cell car that appeared at the Japanese motor show. It said that this was the future, not electric cars.

Possibly, and that'd be good, but the barriers to entry for that to happen seem to be higher, and no-one is really driving that yet, either in terms of model release, or infrastructure build. It would be a "cleaner" solution, but I wouldn't bet on it happening anytime soon (i.e. before the next decade).

Either way, Audi/VAG and the others are going to have to change fundamentally, and pretty quickly.

Excellent article.
No problems with the strategy and the vision (doing the right things)
I'm worried about the tactical execution (doing things right) given the Goran's links.

I think they'll be fine, and those are relatively minor growing pains. Look at the relatively smooth release of their V7 software ("Autopilot") recently, as an example. It was delayed by a couple of weeks, admittedly - very Telsa/Elon Musk - but my Tesla now accelerates faster, stops better, and handles more crisply (amongst other things) and all done without it leaving my driveway +++ .

I'm pretty sure they've passed the tipping point now, and it's easier to do things right when you've got a simple business model, clear strategy, a great product and the wind direction is on in your favour. None of which seems to apply to the major players - dismantling and rebuilding a multibillion $ enterprise/ecosystem is far, far harder for them to do. Though to be fair to the Germans, at least they're trying: JLR don't seem to have a clue about what's happening/about to happen.

For me it only makes sense to buy new Tesla under warranty and get rid of it before warranty expires.

Without warranty the cost to repair it will kill all savings made on petrol, mot, etc.

Just read Goran's links.

That'll be the standard 8 year, 100k mileage warranty on the motor and drivetrain then? Major peace of mind in my book, along with the way that they rectify any minor issues (which are rare) without quibbling - and with no passing the buck about whether it's the dealer/franchisee or NSO, or manufacturer's fault.

That's great to know. My current strategy is identifying a car model which was built to last (perhaps by mistake +++), buying that model in used condition with expired warranty and then driving the car forever (until I smash it or until petrol is finished on planet Earth). Keeping it in good condition of course

It seems when electric cars will start seriously replacing petrol cars that strategy should change.

I will wait to see how well the new two-motor drive train lasts.
In theory even with the rear-wheel-drive system the solution may be easy, but too expensive, more exotic material for the gears of the simple one speed reduction gearbox. Of course a even simpler fix would be the much tougher straight-cut gears which would be ultra noisy.

I believe the real future is to throw away another archaic component, the gearbox with its oily mechanical gears and metal-on metal friction. There is a new breed of asynchronous AC motors out there that use a variable number of phases, effectively variable gearing within the motor itself.
From a stop they can use a high number of phases to have much larger starting torque, at very high speed they can simulate only 3 phases to have high rpm efficiency.
Perhaps Tesla will move onto these in the future.

For me, the whole point of a electric drive system is to not have to rely on warranty, it should last well beyond the life of any internal combustion engine.

In Yugoslavia we still use electric locomotives from the 70s with one asynchronous AC motor per axle. I don't think these locos get much maintenance, and sure now and then some do break down, but its amazing that with minimal maintenance and no investment these drive systems have lasted over 40 years. In short that's what I expect from Tesla, and any other pure electric car. Of course the battery wont last that long, but the drive system must.

Tesla won't say but they are almost definitely using Borg Warner's eGearDrive transmission. On some forum someone suggested they are cast gears, but that could be hearsay.

Is this a good design?

http://articles.sae.org/7953/

http://www.electric-vehiclenews.com/...t-now-has.html

A bit of history between Tesla and Borg Warner.

https://gigaom.com/2009/08/17/tesla-...sion-troubles/

There are many, many problems with hydrogen fuel cells. The fuel is volatile. There's no established infrastructure. It's expensive (£53 to fill your car with hydrogen at Heathrow). It can't "burst" power in the way a battery can without using big, heavy capacitors.

Hydrogen is just a medium for transporting energy. You can fully charge a your £50,000 Tesla for a couple of quid. Filling up your slower, more expensive £53,000 Hyundai ix35 costs nearly as much as a tank of diesel.

There are no brakes on the hype-train

http://www.nanoflowcell.com/

I'm sure it can do that in a different way :)

"Toyota's proprietary, small, light-weight fuel cell stack and two 70 MPa high-pressure hydrogen tanks placed beneath the specially designed body"

70MPa is rouhgly 10,000Psi. sounds fine :)
Because in the history of hydrogen propulsion nothing bad ever happened from storing large amounts of hydrogen at high pressure.

Another interesting point of view:

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articl...=BBD110615_BIZ

I can't find much fault with that article. It continually surprises me that the big manufacturers haven't identified the threat or the opportunity. They behave as if the electric car will start to take off a decade from now. It started happening 3 our 4 years ago.

Oh dear, I did wonder how long it would be before someone did this with their "autopilot" ahem. . . .

http://www.topgear.com/car-news/futu...el-s-back-seat

Bye Bye Audi Dealer Network….
 

…Well, maybe….

http://www.valuewalk.com/2015/11/aud...e-sales-model/

More Tesla vs sportcar fun.
That GT sure sounds good though.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NTFlWcc-1o4

So, when's a P90D going to drop to £15k ;)

Not for a long, long, time, if this continues…

http://www.fleetnews.co.uk/news/flee...r-car-says-cap

I was joking £15k is way too low to expect :)
But I don't agree with the article. Lets wait and see. UK is notoriously the lowest priced second hand car market when compared to Europe, USA and many other countries.

Its difficult to find the original P85+ price now, but for example in Europe they have dropped by as much as 35% in just two years.

Here is one for 75k euros, with two owners on Tesla forum quoting their particular options cost 117k euros and 118k euros back in 2013.

http://www.autoscout24.com/offers/te...grey-266230630

Latest Model S review here:

http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/car-rev...d-2016-review/

and some pre-owned ones now coming on the market for c £40k-ish, such as this one:

https://www.teslamotors.com/en_GB/mo...reowned/p50252

Crazy that I'm actually really tempted by a £40k electric car. Really tempted. Shame Wifey would kill me if I spent that on anything with wheels. But just goes to show how Tesla have been a 'game changer', to lazily use an Americanism.

Oooerr - a bit worrying. . . .

http://www.pyrofire.co.uk/fire-news/...hile-charging/

.

Update: fire investigation closed down
 

Whilst shutting down the investigation is understandable from the point of view of the local authorities I would imagine that Tesla are pretty keen to understand the issues involved! An problem like this if unresolved could put a big dent in public confidence in the car.
Got a very large fire blanket Steve? :p

Its interesting that some parts did not burn/melt.
I'm guessing the seat frames, like in most cars, are steel therefore did not melt.
And it would seem the A-pillars are steel too as they are the only other things sticking out above the door line.
I wonder if the aluminium roof and door sheets actually burned?

Quote from today's Tesla Q4 2015 Earnings call
 

(Tesla's) "Model S was the only vehicle in its class with growing sales last year. Even on our competitors’ home turf and in countries without government incentives to purchase electric vehicles, Model S is winning.

For example, in Switzerland, Model S outsold the Mercedes Benz S-Class, the BMW 7-Series, the Porsche Panamera and the Audi A-8 combined for the full
year, and also outsold the Mercedes Benz E-Class.

In Germany in Q4, Model S outsold the Porsche Panamera. Finally, across all of Europe last year Model S outsold the Audi A8 and A7 combined and the BMW
7-Series and 6-Series combined"

In fact the only car of the "traditional" big 3 that seems to have (relatively) stable comparable sales volumes is the Mercedes S-class with 21,934 units sold in 2015 (Model S units sold 25,202) compared to 25,276 units in 2014 (Model S units sold 16,689).

Wow. That reads like a death knell.

The big ICE producers have been slow to respond again. Let's hope they do respond, as they ought to, before too long.

I didn't realise the big exec car sales were being hit that bad by the Model S.
Lets hope that kicks them into action to make some decent pure electric versions of their big models. None of this over complicated hybrid stuff or the energy efficiency bankrupt hydrogen cars.

Very interesting article on Tesla'a autonomous driving tech.

https://www.technologyreview.com/s/6...sla-autopilot/

It's not a bad article, but a bit out of date now, as Tesla have now released the next version of Autopilot in the UK, which includes their "Summon" feature, that allows you to call the car to you, without you being inside the vehicle.

Does it come with a wrist watch?

Haha! - you mean like this? http://www.technobuffalo.com/2016/02...ummon-a-tesla/

Wow! The future is here! :D

Nah...this is the future (make sure you listen with sound up ;) )

https://youtu.be/vYyzTLzXEcA