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RNS-D and TMC retrofit 2001 FL 3.7
Thanks to Ranj, I now have in my possession an RNS-D satnav unit and TMC module.
I believe the car the rns-d was removed from has Bose, as do I so the coding of the headunit using VCDS should be correct already. Whilst I can probably get my head around the connection on the back of the RNS-D (assuming its a straight swap for my double din Symphony) the TMC module is a whole new kettle of fish. I have located a cable set on ebay http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1207551036...ht_2283wt_1168 looks like the right sort of thing, hopefully it comes with instructions, but apart from the aerial cables I am not sure how the other wires will connect and to where?. |
My old car did have Bose, so hopefully that's unit you chose.
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Yep, I have the one that was in your old car.
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That cable will get the TMC working (and thus put the Radio/Satnav info on the DIS), and is an easy install. Power, ground, canbus pair to car and canbus pair to Nav unit.
You will also need something like this: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Plug-Play-...06%26rk%3D1%26 To give you the extra connector that plugs into the RNS-D. Also - If you have symphony 2, I'm 99.999% sure it doesnt have a GALA feed into it, and the Sat Nav absolutely needs one, so you will need to tap that off the back of the instrument cluster where it is generated. Other than that, it should be pretty straightforward +++ |
I have ordered both cables, that's the plug and play harness, and the TMC wiring cable I linked to, also ordered a hockey puck GPS receiver and some radio removal keys.
I guess I only need the additional connector from the plug and play loom to connect the can signals to from the TMC? I have a Symphony MK1, and looking at the pinout diagram I found on the internet it has a Gala input. Hopefully the wire will be present in the existing connector, otherwise I'll get one from the cluster whilst its out. |
All the wiring has now been delivered.
Need some hints with the TMC kit though as it has no instructions. The grey wires have the pins that look like they simply plug into the appropriate pins on the back of the RNS-D. (Can-H and Can-L). Red and Brown, I think are power (+ red and - Brown), but then I have two other cables Orange/Purple and Orange Brown which I assume are for the cluster end. They have supplied Scotch lock connectors, but which wires on the back of the cluster do I patch into. |
Answering my own question, I have come across this.
http://www.audipages.com/upgrades/navpluscan.html on audipages, looks like the loom I have is using OEM colours. Just need to sort where to get the power from, not sure if it need an always on or switched supply. |
Boy is it tight behind the symphony head unit.
Started work on the install this evening, So far the following is complete. Disconnected existing text nav in the boot by removing the connectors, after removing the NAV CD. Symphony MK1 out, Plug and play loom 26 pin connector opened up and CAN-H and CAN-L pins from the TMC loom inserted into position 13 and 26. RNS-D hooked up using plug and play loom, and other connections all connected. Turned on, bung in code and it all works. Complains about TMC module, as its not yet connected. Tried to remove instrument cluster, however I need to get hold of another toolbox. I dont have the required tool to undo the screw (doh). So I now have a working RNS-D, but without DIS integration or GPS yet. Still to do. Remove dash cluster, Install TMC Module, Patch CAN wires into Cluster, Connect TMC power supply. Install and connect GPS aerial. So slowly coming together. |
install
You are doing well...sounds like you will be done in a day or so...
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Decided today to update the firmware, the RNS-D had the November 2001 firmware installed. So, downloaded the 2003 version and copied to CD.
45 mins later and the unit is updated and now showing as the 2003 version. I now however have a technical problem, when the unit is on when I press the navigation button I get the message "The navigation is being activated, please wait..." and it just sits there even with no Navigation disk inserted. If I insert the disk nothing happens, the message remains. If I switch off the RNS-D leave it for 5 mins and switch on the unit spits out the Navigation CD. If I then put the disk back in, the firmware update screen pops up. The navigation CD is a 2005 one, so newer than the installed firmware. The error may just be because I have no GPS connected yet, but it was fine yesterday without it. Just thought I was in Coventry all the time. |
Played with it some more this evening and finally managed to get it to recognise the 2005 navigation CD.
Basically when I put the disk in, the firmware upgrade screen was popping up all the time. Previously I selected the End option, and pressed return after popping the disk back in. This is what resulted in the system saying "navigation being activated". This time by chance rather than pressing return, I pressed the right hand knob inwards and it worked. Up popped a message "Loading navigation data" and a couple of mins later I was back in business. Tidied up the wiring behind the unit this evening, and removed the Video in motion button from the plug and play loom as it will never be used, even if I add a video source. My A8 has a standard windscreen, so I test mounted the GPS receiver on the dash by the tax disc. Works fine in that location, picks up 6 satellites and gets a fix no problem so that's where I'll fix it I think. Still need to get the dashpod out to install the TMC and dash can connections, still don't know what size those weird screws are. They look like allen key bolts, so maybe a small allen key will work. I don't know if its my ears, but after doing the firmware upgrade the sound quality has improved and has more bass at all volume levels and actually sounds the same as the Symphony MK1. Before it sounded a little flat, even on the same settings. |
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wondered if you could point me in the direction of where you got the firmware upgrade from Manny please?
cheers |
Brian, the filename is AUDIFW2003.zip
Download here, http://www.lumpistefan.de/Audi/AUDIFW2003.zip Then basically extract the zip file to a folder. Then using Nero, Roxio or simillar create a standard data ISO CD (Not UDF format) and drag / drop the contents of the folder onto the CD. Burn at a slow speed (I used 4x) and make sure the session is closed. Restart the RNS-D holding down the flag and navigation buttons as you press power. Select Eject CDRom, and remove the navigation CD. Insert your FW disk, and at the bottom it should pop up next to CD version as 2003. below that are two options, select the top one, not the TMC one. System will check CD, restart, and update the headunit, System will restart again, and update the graphics software, System will restart again and tell you that the update was successful. Remove now ejected firmware CD, and put your nav disk back in. Press the right knob in to accept, don't do what I did and press return as prompted. |
thanks for that, might give it a try if it improves the sound quality
cheers+++ |
bolts for instrument cluster
The hex socket no 4. to undo the bolts on the instrument cluster and then it will pull forward....when you do put a towel over the top plastic part of the steering wheel as the instrument cluster might scratch it as you are fiddling to get the plugs off.
If the plugs havent been off will be some zip ties back there...patience and you will succeed. The two can wires you want to tap into are on the green plug. pin 21 for canbus low pin 22 for canbus high Good luck you are almost there!!!!! |
Yep, almost there.
However, today I drove around town with the GPS aerial sitting on the dash. The RNS-D is seeing 8 satellites, so no problem there, however the map position completely wrong. The arrow is behind by a good 300 yards or more, and slightly to one side. Can you calibrate your position on the map using the crosshairs like you can on the VW MFD/MFD2?. I hope its not a bad GPS aerial, don't think it is as the compass display works well. Tomorrow, I am off to Hertfordshire from Dorset to finish the install and put the car back together. I'll put some pictures up of the install when finished of course, but I am sure you have all seen an A8 with RNS-D a hundred times before. |
What happens when you park up does it eventually get the position right?
The satnav uses the inbuilt compass to work out which direct the car is heading and the speed signal from the car, the position is then corrected by the gps every minute or so. |
I believe that Gala is working, in that the map updates ok as I drive along, its just the positioning is way off. Even sitting in the car stationary it's never right.
I have the Gala wire on the cars loom on pin1, and the plug and play loom passes this to the correct pin on the 26 way connector. is there a way to check that Gala is working, by accessing a menu somewhere. |
It takes a little while to calibrate the GALA etc.
Strictly speaking, the speed pulse signal off a factory fit unit comes direct from the ABS unit, and the pulses are far more frequent, and thus more accurate. The pulses from gala are less frequent, but will do the job ok. If you take an RNS-D from a factory fit car running ABS pulses to a retrofit running GALA pulses it will take maybe 10/15 mins of driving before they come into alignment. Until then, the GPS will keep correcting it, but the arrow will race off at the wrong speed. This is quite normal. They always constantly calibrate in the background to allow for tyre wear etc, so if you change wheels for example and have a slightly different circumference, it will sort itself out quite quickly with no intervention. Note as well that a factory fit unit should have a connection to the reversing signal so it knows when the pulses are going backwards. It keeps things more accurate if you're 3 point turning in a multistorey car park for example and want it to have some clue where you are when you hit the main road. Without it, the GPS will correct it when it gets a fix again. Incidently, the RNS-D can calibrate to the much slower speed of the GALA pulse (as can the VW/Seat/Skoa MFD)- The RNS-C cannot. Retrofitting an RNS-C requires the speed pulse hardwiring from the ABS controller in the Plenum chamber in the engine bay. And yes. I learned that the really hard way +++ |
I think your right, I have driven 144 miles this morning and its now spot on. At least I have a map to look at, unlike the basic text nav that went before. However it is very basic when compared to the RNS-510 I had in my previous car, but I am glad to be able to see on a map my location again.
Just need to hook up the power to the TMC and the patch into the cluster can signal then the job is finished. |
And I think we are there.
All connected, complete with Navigation instructions on the DIS. However, I have the following to resolve. 1) With the radio connected through the TMC module there is no reception, I have the radio aerial directly into the RNS-D and it works fine. Not sure why this does not work, might not even be worth sorting as the later DX UK nav discs no longer have TMC data. Lastly 2) Although the navigation data is displaying on the DIS, the radio station info is not at the top like it was on the Symphony. I have tried turning it off and on again in the DIS menu but this is still missing. I have a feeling this maybe a coding issue, although I don't know where to start. Pasted below are the results of a current VCDS scan. Saturday,15,September,2012,15:05:20:10074 VCDS Version: Release 10.6.4 (x64) Data version: 20110418 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Chassis Type: 4D - Audi A8 D2 Scan: 01 03 08 11 15 16 17 18 25 35 37 45 55 56 57 65 67 75 76 77 02 VIN: WAUZZZ4DZ1NXXXXXX ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Address 01: Engine Labels: None Part No: 4D0 907 558 N Component: 3.7l V8/5V G 0001 Coding: 11753 Shop #: WSC 02313 VCID: 387B2CD332C3 WAUZZZ4DZ1NXXXXXX AUZ7Z0Y1573817 No fault code found. Readiness: 0110 1101 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Address 03: ABS Brakes Labels: 8D0-907-389.lbl Part No: 4D0 907 389 E Component: ABS/ESP allrad D46 Coding: 08397 Shop #: WSC 23132 VCID: 316D11F7D1B9 No fault code found. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Address 08: Auto HVAC Labels: VCID: 55A585678591 Note: Excessive Comm Errors ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Address 15: Airbags Labels: 4D0-959-655-AI8.lbl Part No: 4D0 959 655 T Component: Airbag Front+Kopf 4000 Coding: 01417 Shop #: WSC 02335 VCID: 43814B3F7B05 No fault code found. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Address 17: Instruments Labels: Part No: 4D0 919 035 AJ Component: D2-KOMBIINSTR. VDO D29 Coding: 00483 Shop #: WSC 02313 VCID: 6ED7CA8B0007 No Faults Found or DTCs not supported by controller or a communication error occurred ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Address 35: Centr. Locks Labels: 8D0-862-257.lbl Part No: 8L0 862 257 P Component: CV-Pump, Alarm, RC D17 Coding: 13130 Shop #: WSC 00000 VCID: 428F4E3B641F No fault code found. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Address 37: Navigation Labels: Redir Fail! Part No: 4D0 035 192 M Component: RNS 4.2 H06 BNO 0140 VCID: 295DF997F969 No fault code found. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Address 55: Xenon Range Labels: 4B0-907-357-DYN.lbl Part No: 4B0 907 357 C Component: dynamische LWR D05 Coding: 00001 Shop #: WSC 00000 VCID: 285BFC93E263 No fault code found. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Address 56: Radio Labels: Redir Fail! Part No: 4D0 035 192 M Component: Radio BNO 0001 Coding: 00017 Shop #: WSC 00976 VCID: 295DF997F969 No fault code found. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Address 76: Park Assist Labels: 4D0-919-283.lbl Part No: 4D0 919 283 Component: Parkingsystem A8 RDW D07 Coding: 01108 Shop #: WSC 00000 VCID: E8DB3C93A2E3 No fault code found. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Address 02: Auto Trans Labels: 01V-927-156.lbl Part No: 4D0 927 156 DD Component: AG5 01V 3.7l5V RdW 3838 Coding: 00001 Shop #: WSC 02313 VCID: 6ED7CA8B0007 No fault code found. End --------------------------------------------------------------------- |
Sorted the radio display problem on the DIS.
VCDS - Controller 17, instruments, Adaption 10. Channel 62, previously set to 4, now set to 5 as per a post I found elsewhere on the internet. Bingo, Radio data now displaying in DIS, same with CD number and track info. So all is now well apart from the TMC aerial leads not working. Refitted the instrument cluster, and found it really difficult to push back in. I hope all is well back there, as I have added quiet a lot behind the cluster. |
As I recall, TMC only ever worked on mine if tuned into Classic Radio, or whatever it's called, have you tried that?
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it picks up no stations at all, only static with the TMC module in the loop. Then when you scan the radio with VCDS there is an antenna fault error.
I have left the module bypassed for radio now, everything else works perfectly. |
If the TMC was from my old car, it may possibly be faulty. When I bought the car the radio reception was non-existent. The car had a new aerial fitted in place of the phone aerial. I knew Ranj was going to fit the RNS-E, so never went too much into the details of what happened when I got the car, therefore he was unaware that there may be a problem with it.
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tmc module
the tmc module is from a different car.
I found with Reffro's car that the aerial was totally aftermarket and the wiring from the aerial had a connector which was not quite compatible with connector on the back of the rns d....someone had taped the two connectors together hence not a good connection.... I dont think tmc module would cause issue with radio reception to be honest, but it is on my to do list. |
I dont mind the fact the TMC does not work for Radio, it would have just been good.
Looking at the guide to install the RNS-E, maybe in the future. Having completed this I now feel that an E install is far simpler in comparison. |
with rns e
The issue with an rns e install is the getting the unit at the right price as you need one from an a6 so you can trim the sides down, which are normally quite pricey around the 5-600 mark.....unless you can get hold of the fascia off a broken rns e....
I would keep an eye out for a broken rns e from an a6....and then get the cheaper rns e's from an a3 and switch the fascias over. Managed that and the rest will be a doddle....the annoying element is that you lose the dis instruction on the instrument cluster...otherwise plain sailing once you have done a rns d instal. |
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I did this just the other day, using the procedure above. :cool: |
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