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  #251  
Old 27th July 2020, 07:07 PM
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moltuae moltuae is offline
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Found this video quite interesting:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nreXNspBHgQ

They make some good points about why the Osborne Effect is making the transition to EVs very difficult, if not impossible, for the big ICE car manufacturers.
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Mark
------------------------------------------------------
2002 FE S8 Ebony Black Pearl
------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------------------------------
Cars Owned:
The Tesla Era: 2020 Model S Performance Ludicrous+ (present)
(Black, with all black premium interior and carbon fibre décor, 21" sonic carbon twin turbine wheels and FSD capability)

The Audi Era: '97 A8 4.2 (Ming Blue) --> '96 A8 4.2 QS (Dark Green) --> '02 FE S8 (present)
The Citroen Era: '84 BX 1.6 RS --> '89 BX 1.9 DTR Turbo --> '94 XM 2.0L Turbo --> '96 XM 2.0L Turbo Exclusive --> '00 Xantia Activa 2.0L Turbo
The Banger Era: '76 1.2L Lada VAZ-2101 (Ruski Fiat 124) --> '80 1.7L Morris Ital HL, finished in Ermine White and Rust
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  #252  
Old 28th July 2020, 08:50 PM
tintin tintin is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moltuae View Post
Found this video quite interesting:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nreXNspBHgQ

They make some good points about why the Osborne Effect is making the transition to EVs very difficult, if not impossible, for the big ICE car manufacturers.
Yup, these guys are right (when they finally get to the point ), and I've been saying the same thing for years. It's now just the same for "Big Auto" as it has been with other sectors before/currently (hitech, retail, etc, etc). In all these cases old, established players have got fat, lazy, and arrogant, and have then been blindsided by an upstart whom they should have seen coming, who turns the sector on its head, and makes it much more focussed on what the customer wants and values.

Sadly, this often ends in massive restructuring (or complete erasure ), and the size and scale of that is always in direct proportion to the degree of fatness, laziness and arrogance of the existing players. I've seen this all too often in lots of "world class" organisations in the past (e.g. Kodak, Polaroid, Motorola, Ericcson, etc, etc), many of who were my clients at the time.

What's really sad is that often this failure to see this coming isn't for logical/economic reasons, but for human/emotional reasons (e.g. ego and arrogance - ). JLR's CEO is a classic example of this, in his initial "arrogant denial" mode (see here: https://europe.autonews.com/article/...uggles-for-evs ) - a view he espoused after Tesla had been successfully selling the Model S for several years) and consequently resulted in them wasting billions in new diesel engine investment. At about the same time, VAG were proclaiming even bigger investments in similar existing technology - also now effectively a write-off, with the concomitant impact on the livelihood of thousands of VAG employees.

The trouble is that often it's the size of these established organisations that is both the cause of this blindness to the need for change, and also of their inability to react quickly ("like turning a supertanker" to quote a rather cliched phrase). At least the new Audi CEO sort of gets this ("Tesla is 2 years ahead of the industry in critical areas, Audi CEO says": https://electrek.co/2020/07/27/tesla...reas-audi-ceo/ ), and recognises that he can't wait for the supertanker, so has to build a something new - a leaner, more agile organisation in order to try to catch up.

Until all of the major existing players in Big Auto both (a) recognise they need to do this and (b) succeed in making this happen, they'll continue to fail, sadly. But I hope they do manage it & it's fascinating to watch them try!
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Autos Autos everywhere...
(1) Tesla Model S: (was 85D, now 90D ). Silent and deadly, and very, very fast... But not as fast as Ian's - or Mark's either now
(2) 2003 D2 S8 Final Edition: Bulletproof and faultless: Ebony Black with Extended (Red!) Leather. Three-times annual winner of Best D2 1st prize forum trophy
(3) Fiat Coupe 20v Turbo: Scots (! ) Green. Fragile, but beautiful.
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  #253  
Old 2nd October 2020, 06:56 PM
A8 Doc A8 Doc is offline
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Originally Posted by IT View Post
Nice..... Another Model S joins the A8 fold....

Another Tesla has joined the forum recently too - but its not my news to share ;-)

I'm still actively looking to sell on my Q7 and pick up either another model 3 or a model S. The company car incentives are so far off the scale, its verging on insanity not to......

No tax disc now - they are exempt from luxury road tax and I now have my smart charger set to only charge it when my octopus agile tariff is less than 4p / kwh.

For some basic maths, that makes the Tesla cost about 1.5p per mile to run.... and that's enthusiastic B road driving.... :-)
Another A8 and Tesla owner.....!

Tesla X Performance 2020 here with FSD. Great car.

Ordered an S Plaid as well.
__________________
Current '8' - 2003 D3 A8 - Crystal Blue, Heated Seats Front and Back, BOSE, Twin Pane Glass, Blue Sports Leather and Alcantara, 20" MultiSpoke Alloys, Xenons, TV, Sports Suspension (Lowered 10mm), Folding Mirros, 3 Spoke sports MFSW, Rain Sensor, Interior and Exterior Lighting Pack, BRC LPG, Twin PS2 and RSE and more!

Previous 8's - - 3 x 4.2 LPG D3's, 1 x 3.0TDi D3 and 1 x S8 V10. Plus 1 x D2 4.2 S8 on LPG!

Current Cars - 2003 A8 D3, 2007 Saab 9-3 2.8T Convertible, 2013 Range Rover Sport TDV6 Autobiography, 2000 BMW M5, 2004 BMW M3, Seat Ibiza 1.9T 450bhp GT30, Saab 9-5 2.3T 300bhp
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  #254  
Old 2nd October 2020, 07:55 PM
tintin tintin is offline
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Originally Posted by A8 Doc View Post
Another A8 and Tesla owner.....!

Tesla X Performance 2020 here with FSD. Great car.

Ordered an S Plaid as well.
Welcome to the fold
__________________

Autos Autos everywhere...
(1) Tesla Model S: (was 85D, now 90D ). Silent and deadly, and very, very fast... But not as fast as Ian's - or Mark's either now
(2) 2003 D2 S8 Final Edition: Bulletproof and faultless: Ebony Black with Extended (Red!) Leather. Three-times annual winner of Best D2 1st prize forum trophy
(3) Fiat Coupe 20v Turbo: Scots (! ) Green. Fragile, but beautiful.
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  #255  
Old 2nd October 2020, 08:04 PM
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moltuae moltuae is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A8 Doc View Post
Another A8 and Tesla owner.....!

Tesla X Performance 2020 here with FSD. Great car.

Ordered an S Plaid as well.


Just out of interest, did you manage to get free supercharging with your Model X?

It seems they've stopped offering it with new vehicle purchases again now. I was lucky enough to get free supercharging with my Model S (which I purchased back in May). I was going to delay purchasing it for a few months too. Glad I didn't now!
__________________
Mark
------------------------------------------------------
2002 FE S8 Ebony Black Pearl
------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------------------------------
Cars Owned:
The Tesla Era: 2020 Model S Performance Ludicrous+ (present)
(Black, with all black premium interior and carbon fibre décor, 21" sonic carbon twin turbine wheels and FSD capability)

The Audi Era: '97 A8 4.2 (Ming Blue) --> '96 A8 4.2 QS (Dark Green) --> '02 FE S8 (present)
The Citroen Era: '84 BX 1.6 RS --> '89 BX 1.9 DTR Turbo --> '94 XM 2.0L Turbo --> '96 XM 2.0L Turbo Exclusive --> '00 Xantia Activa 2.0L Turbo
The Banger Era: '76 1.2L Lada VAZ-2101 (Ruski Fiat 124) --> '80 1.7L Morris Ital HL, finished in Ermine White and Rust
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  #256  
Old 2nd October 2020, 10:32 PM
tintin tintin is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moltuae View Post


Just out of interest, did you manage to get free supercharging with your Model X?

It seems they've stopped offering it with new vehicle purchases again now. I was lucky enough to get free supercharging with my Model S (which I purchased back in May). I was going to delay purchasing it for a few months too. Glad I didn't now!
It's funny, isn't it? The actual "cash" benefit of this is pretty small as a % of the cost of the car, but there's something wonderfully liberating about driving around (silently...) for free, instead of burning £1 every 4 miles or so
__________________

Autos Autos everywhere...
(1) Tesla Model S: (was 85D, now 90D ). Silent and deadly, and very, very fast... But not as fast as Ian's - or Mark's either now
(2) 2003 D2 S8 Final Edition: Bulletproof and faultless: Ebony Black with Extended (Red!) Leather. Three-times annual winner of Best D2 1st prize forum trophy
(3) Fiat Coupe 20v Turbo: Scots (! ) Green. Fragile, but beautiful.
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  #257  
Old 3rd October 2020, 08:00 AM
moltuae's Avatar
moltuae moltuae is offline
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Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: East Lancs.
Posts: 2,638
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tintin View Post
It's funny, isn't it? The actual "cash" benefit of this is pretty small as a % of the cost of the car, but there's something wonderfully liberating about driving around (silently...) for free, instead of burning £1 every 4 miles or so
I suppose it is quite a small saving, compared with burning through petrol in a big V8, especially relative to the cost of the Tesla. And if you compare only the electricity costs, that you would otherwise have to pay, it's an even smaller saving.

But, yeah, you're right, it's not just about the cost savings. It is liberating to know that you can travel anywhere for free, and it's also kinda neat. It's a nice privilege/perk to be able to pull up at an exclusive parking spot in a service station, plug in and watch the battery quickly recharge, knowing that the vehicle's manufacturer is picking up the tab.

It's a bit like having all-you-can-eat broadband instead of a pay-per-gigabit connection. You might not take advantage of the unlimited data allowance all the time but it's good to know you can when you want to, without having to care about costs or monthly limits.

It is quite a substantial saving on a long trip however (compared with driving the S8). A typical trip to Southampton and back, including some driving around down there, used to cost me around £300 in petrol. That's typically about the same as the weekend's accommodation costs. Now that I can travel the country for free, it makes me want to get away and travel more or spend more on accommodation.
__________________
Mark
------------------------------------------------------
2002 FE S8 Ebony Black Pearl
------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------------------------------
Cars Owned:
The Tesla Era: 2020 Model S Performance Ludicrous+ (present)
(Black, with all black premium interior and carbon fibre décor, 21" sonic carbon twin turbine wheels and FSD capability)

The Audi Era: '97 A8 4.2 (Ming Blue) --> '96 A8 4.2 QS (Dark Green) --> '02 FE S8 (present)
The Citroen Era: '84 BX 1.6 RS --> '89 BX 1.9 DTR Turbo --> '94 XM 2.0L Turbo --> '96 XM 2.0L Turbo Exclusive --> '00 Xantia Activa 2.0L Turbo
The Banger Era: '76 1.2L Lada VAZ-2101 (Ruski Fiat 124) --> '80 1.7L Morris Ital HL, finished in Ermine White and Rust
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  #258  
Old 3rd October 2020, 06:49 PM
A8 Doc A8 Doc is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: North Yorkshire
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moltuae View Post


Just out of interest, did you manage to get free supercharging with your Model X?

It seems they've stopped offering it with new vehicle purchases again now. I was lucky enough to get free supercharging with my Model S (which I purchased back in May). I was going to delay purchasing it for a few months too. Glad I didn't now!
I did indeed. Purchased December 2019 though.

Horrific paint issues though with the car, kinda had to look past that really and admire the Jaguar & Porsche if I want to look at paint!

Free supercharging is worth it for me, often doing 1000 miles a week at present so its a bargain. Solar and batteries on house so works well.

Missus has the iPace which she loves but the charging network is disgraceful.

Tesla network is excellent.
__________________
Current '8' - 2003 D3 A8 - Crystal Blue, Heated Seats Front and Back, BOSE, Twin Pane Glass, Blue Sports Leather and Alcantara, 20" MultiSpoke Alloys, Xenons, TV, Sports Suspension (Lowered 10mm), Folding Mirros, 3 Spoke sports MFSW, Rain Sensor, Interior and Exterior Lighting Pack, BRC LPG, Twin PS2 and RSE and more!

Previous 8's - - 3 x 4.2 LPG D3's, 1 x 3.0TDi D3 and 1 x S8 V10. Plus 1 x D2 4.2 S8 on LPG!

Current Cars - 2003 A8 D3, 2007 Saab 9-3 2.8T Convertible, 2013 Range Rover Sport TDV6 Autobiography, 2000 BMW M5, 2004 BMW M3, Seat Ibiza 1.9T 450bhp GT30, Saab 9-5 2.3T 300bhp
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