Another D2 S8 gets some TLC

[ThisWayUp]

It’s time for my S8 to receive some long over due TLC. It was bought to replace an ageing Saab 9-3 Aero, as it seemed easier to deal with mechanical issues rather than chase tin worm. I may regret that thought, and wish I was merely waving a sparkly stick at a Saab.

It’s a FL car with about 155k under it’s belt. I bought it on eBay blind, which in fairness turned out okay. The gearbox was an unknown so always likely to be my main issue.

It’s a bit rough round the edges, but I think it’s saveable. Depressingly it’ll need money spent on areas of wear and tear rather than the cosmetic bits. At some point it’s lost its alloy mirrors and the grille had been swapped out to an all black aftermarket affair, neither of which did it justice.
I like the overall colour scheme. The interior is black leather, with a dark wood and dark headlining.

As luck would have it I had a business trip to the USA (PA) and there was a guy breaking a D2 S8 in NJ. A couple of messages later I had agreed for him to send wing mirrors, grille and fuel filler flap down to PA for my visit the following week. Bit of a pleasing result.

The car was used for a while, and was generally good. A noisy auxiliary belt idler was replaced to quieten things down. However, it started to suffer from the smell of burning transmission oil. Living in Glasgow meant it was convenient to put it into Mackie’s to establish what was going on. The news wasn’t too good. Seemingly oil was passing from the final drive into the transmission and flooding it out of breather, and hence towards the exhaust. They also identified an oil leak from the rear of engine. To keep things going they sorted the oil levels out, and I used it lightly for a short period.
I even eradicated the plague of locusts behind the dashboard by replacing some of the HVAC servo motors. That felt like a significant improvement.

The PAS pipes were also looking frail, so this was another concern. I also don’t really like the brakes. I put new calipers and discs on the back, but the front end really needs some attention.

Lockdown occurred so it’s really not been used at all, but I had my Cerbera’s engine in bits due to a shattered inlet valve shim, so I really needed to press on with that and get it over the line. Nothing worse than having two dismantled cars in a completely unsalable condition. Anyway, by October the Cerbera was up a running. I did 100m miles shakedown around Glasgow and then used it for a business trip down to Peterborough. A win all round, as it survived, I survived, the engine got run in, and it only locked me out at Scotch Corner Services. I scratch built new door wiring harnesses over the winter, complete with waterproof connectors, so that is now a problem of the past.

Back to the plot. I’ve started to take the S8 apart to see what the state of play is. I followed the Elsa instructions (thanks Gregor) and the only sticking point really was unhooking the transmission cable from the switch. Getting the engine and transmission out was an interesting solo mission.

IMG_2889

With the engine out the bay doesn’t look too shoddy. There are however many areas that need attention. I’ve been diligently following MJ’s WITW projects (Huge thanks for all your ideas, tips and general information), so that prepared me for some of the typical issues. We could actually develop D2 WITW Bingo. I don’t quite have a full house, but it’s a good effort nonetheless.

IMG_2890

Off the top of my head I think it needs the following:

Vacuum system is needing many perished pipes replaced
Inlet manifold is pretty sticky, so probably not working
Sump needs resealed
Rear main seal is the source of the leak
Usual service items Timing belt/waterpump/tensioner/spark plugs/filters/thermostat etc..
Junction box for starter cable is kanckered
ECU box has missing inserts and wasn’t sealing
PAS hoses need a complete refurbishment
Transmission needs a rebuild. Possibly needs a valve block rebuild as it was an enthusiastic creeper!
Exhaust mount rubbers are poorly
Front (maybe) and rear crank seals
All rubber hoses for the cooling system
Transmission hoses – re-build
Stubby cooling pipe at oil cooler
New front discs
Rebuild front calipers
New front pads

My Excel sheet of parts and part numbers is growing by the day.
There are a couple of items that I’m pondering whether to do while I’m this far in. Is the oil cooler unit worth doing while it’s easy to access? Looks cheapish compared to a day of labour later on.

From the experience of pulling the engine out, I’m quite liking the idea of building it all back onto a refurbished subframe, and then stuffing the lot in from beneath. That does seem so much cleaner. Dropping the subframe at this stage seems sensible, but I think I’ll get the engine progressed, then the transmission rebuilt and then as the final stage do the subframe and front brakes.

I should be bankrupt and destitute by that stage.

Anyway, too many words. Some more photographs.

Sparkplugs as fitted by Noah, many years ago, before torque wrenches were invented..
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Front of the engine isn’t too horrific to be fair. Certainly not fresh oil.
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I’ve never liked mounting engines on stands. TVR engine block was made of something similar to chocolate, so I never dared to use this.
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A bit of cleaning later


First pass of cleaning the valley out. The Borrowers could have built at least three sandcastles with this one. It wasn’t too bad. The knock sensors are intact and didn’t fall to bits.


Overall it’s been predictable based on what’s been before it. It’s really a case of being pragmatic about what to do mechanically. In terms of cosmetics it could do with:

New tyres – Ditch Finders are not good
Wheel refurb badly needed
Rear Bumper – cover is split
Front wing damaged at arch – probably easier to fit new and paint.

The paintwork is not bad, so localised repairs would have it looking pretty good.

If you read this far, you did well!! Thanks!
Brian

[MikkiJayne]

A couple of little jobs to do then 11/10 for taking the engine out and leaving the downpipes in place That's not an easy way to do it. You do seem to have a pretty good score on WITW bingo though.

I've only once heard of a 5HP mixing diff oil and ATF. There are a bunch of seals between the two areas and failures appear to be quite rare but not impossible.

Those spark plugs look like they belong in a flathead Ford V8, not an Audi V8! I don't think I've seen Champion plugs in the last decade tbh. Bosch or NGK are OE in most VAG stuff I encounter so I stick with them. Bosch FGR6KQE are cheap enough.

Oil cooler failures are pretty rare. I'd leave it alone tbh and just change the plastic pipe for an aluminium one.

Are you sure its the rear main leaking and not just oil dripping down from the valley? Its 50/50 for the rear main to leak, but 100/0 for the valley leaking and dripping down the back. If it is the rear main, the Elring seal for the 2.5TDI is a straight fit, rather than replacing the whole rear cover (for £300) which Audi want you to do! Elring Dirko sealant is the special sauce for the sump and cam covers btw. Same stuff as OE but 1/4 the price, and in a better package so it lasts longer.

Its worth noting that UK supplies of stuff for D2s is almost dried up, with those remaining suppliers who have stock gouging on price, and those who used to have good prices now taking weeks to get stuff from Germany. I'm having to order from Autodoc a month in advance now because they're the only ones with stock and sensible prices, alas at the expense of the usual suspects in the UK who can no longer compete. I hate Autodoc but they've become the only viable option.

[ThisWayUp]

Thanks MJ - That's really interesting. I'll need to examine the back of the engine in more detail and see what's going on.

That's a useful prompt regards the leadtimes for parts. I really need to crack on and get bits on order or risk extending this project out.

Is the Elring Dirko reasonable to also use on the inlet manifold to seal it all back up?

I'll take a look at the pads on the chain tensioners and see what's happening there. It's not overly 'ticky' on start-up but, as we're this far it would be silly not to take a look and see what's happening.

I was quite please with the radiator. It looks in good condition. I now have good access to replace the noisy old a/c fan with the one that's sat on my shelf for the best part of 18 months. The previous owner spent a bit of money on the a/c and it's fully functional. The fan would run fine as long as you didn't hit a pothole or round a bend too quick, otehrwise it headed off into a 'death wobble' and all the noise that brought.

Thanks,
Brian

[MikkiJayne]

I think the inlet manifold uses a foamed silicone or PU seal. There was a write-up of it on Audizine a few years back I think. Its not particularly easy to replicate, although you can buy foamed silicone sealing cord in various sizes which might do the job. Its rare for an S8 manifold to seize up actually, since the mechanism inside is different to the A8 version. Usually if it gets tight its just the spindles at the front, so you may be able to free it off without splitting it.

It might be worth making a start on that now so that you have time to source whatever is needed to put it back together again whilst doing everything else.

[ThisWayUp]

Originally Posted by MikkiJayne

I think the inlet manifold uses a foamed silicone or PU seal. There was a write-up of it on Audizine a few years back I think. Its not particularly easy to replicate, although you can buy foamed silicone sealing cord in various sizes which might do the job. Its rare for an S8 manifold to seize up actually, since the mechanism inside is different to the A8 version. Usually if it gets tight its just the spindles at the front, so you may be able to free it off without splitting it.

It might be worth making a start on that now so that you have time to source whatever is needed to put it back together again whilst doing everything else.

That's interesting - I'll have a shot at that first. It's on the work bench, so a nice evening task. 'Threebond' was referenced in the article I saw.
I think it might be this article https://www.audiworld.com/forums/a8-...ifold-2966139/

There is another in-depth article, but the links to it are broken, and I've not yet found my way to it manually.

In the spirit of keeping it simple, I'll try my best to see if I can get rid of the sticking without splitting it open.

[ThisWayUp]

Well, that escalated quickly.



The bushings at the front that the actuator arms mount to were actually not bad. One was a little sticky. With both arms off one shaft moves nicely, but the other is somewhat sticky. That left me with no option but to open it up, and see what's happening.

In the photo above I can lift the left hand set of flaps up and when I let them go they make a nice 'clunk' as they close.
The right hand set however, moves slowly and makes a dull sounds as it closes.

I've had a shot of cleaning around the flaps to ensure they are not dragging on any sticky residue on the insides of the inlet tract, and I've put some penetraing oil around the shaft to see if that improves it over time.

It has a trapped rubber seal, but I'm hoping I can clean that up and apply some sealant to re-make the seal.

Looking at it, I'd have to be brave to dimantle this any further as it looks like it would be pretty tough to re-assemble and get all the flaps nicley aligned.

Fingers crossed the penetrating oil does the trick.

[spannerrash]

Hi Brian

I also like to do most of my own repair work but you are taking this to a whole different level. Well done bud I'm really impressed.

The Spectrum power steering pipes are still available if you need them. I'm willing to donate them to anyone who is willing to give them a try. Make sure you read the power steering pipes post though as there were some concerns raised.

Good luck with the project.

Cheers Frank

[David's8]

Good effort in getting down to the real nuts and bolts stuff.
Whereabouts in Glasgow are you? there's a couple of us nearby (Dumbarton and Helensburgh) so it would be good to meet up sometime.

[ThisWayUp]

Originally Posted by spannerrash

Hi Brian

I also like to do most of my own repair work but you are taking this to a whole different level. Well done bud I'm really impressed.

The Spectrum power steering pipes are still available if you need them. I'm willing to donate them to anyone who is willing to give them a try. Make sure you read the power steering pipes post though as there were some concerns raised.

Good luck with the project.

Cheers Frank

Originally Posted by David's8

Good effort in getting down to the real nuts and bolts stuff.
Whereabouts in Glasgow are you? there's a couple of us nearby (Dumbarton and Helensburgh) so it would be good to meet up sometime.

Thanks Frank & David - Been away for a couple days down in Peterborough, so just catching up on various things. It's turned into a bit of an epic, which I knew was likely to happen, as it's got most of the usual issues.

Not sure I'd have been brave enough to tackle this without the wealth of information conatined within these pages though..

Frank - Many thanks - I'm weighing up the PAS pipe options at the moment, to see what route I'm goiong to take on this.

David - I'm over in Giffnock, so not a million miles away. My in-laws are in Helensburgh (West Montrose) sbut I've never actually had the S8 down there. I'll keep an eye out next time I'm down that way.

Once I get the S8 back together I'd definitely be up for a mini-meet. Under pressure to get this finsihed as I'm already getting grumbbling about bits of car strewen around the place..

Need to complete my Autodoc order this weekend, and then speak with the gearbox people. Seems a bit daunting spending more on the gearbox than what the car cost in the first place

[David's8]

i saw that you lived in Gifnock when i checked your first posts I lived just off West Montrose street but have recently moved up the hill near The Hill House to a house with double garage
Let us know when you have got the time and inclination to meet up and we'll get a mini-meet set up