Newbe: Thoughts on changing 18" Avus to 20" BBS LMs

[MrHooky]

Hi all,

New to this forum. I’ve just bought a 2000 S8 D2. Really lovely spec car – the exact colour I wanted. It’s been a well cared for car, lots of money spent of late including new discs and pads all round, plus a gearbox refurbishment at a cost of £2k c.4k miles ago. Currently at 87k miles which is nothing for the age of car.

I also have a 2004 8N 3.2 TT DSG which I’ve had nearly 6 years now. Bought the S8 as a family wagon to cart my 6 and 4 year old around.

So now I’ve had for 2 weeks there are a few things I’m toying with getting done, first up being the wheels.

It’s sat on the 18” Avus wheels which whilst I like the style they are the same size as my TT which is approximately 2/3rd of the size of car. I love BBS wheels (my TT has the optioned 18” RS2 wheels) and I’m tempted to put BBS LM wheels on, inspired by the pic of the black S8 below. I think the black S8 is on 20s but it also looks to be lowered considerably.

My questions, would 20” BBS LMs look too big? Am I right in thinking the later cars had 20” RS wheels as an option? Would 19” be a decent compromise, or would the car still look a bit under-wheeled?

Thoughts appreciated. I can see this car becoming a real passion. A few tasteful mods, full machine polish and new wheels should have it looking fantastic. Still can’t believe how much car you get for your money. Only slight disappointment is I don’t have Bose. My TT does which does seem a little better in terms of Bass although not much in it. Can’t be picky when buying used as there really aren’t many decent examples out there.

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[Delboy]

20" wheels look fine on a d2 IMO and I'm a fan of the LM's so I say do it :D

[Conquistador]

Welcome!

Damn, I had some 20" BBS LM-R wheels on my BMW which I just sold, and sold the wheels separately.

I kindly asked a cousin of mine, a graphic designer, to do a mock-up of them on my S8 from different angles when she had a spare hour or so. Looked good to be fair but I decided I wanted to keep this car looking stock and also didn't like the idea of wheel adaptors to change the stud pattern from BMW to Audi.

But if I had to put some aftermarket wheels on an S8, it would probably be BBSs +++

Any pics of your car?

[Professor Peach]

Welcome along Hooky.

Yep, 20's look just fine on a D2. Mine are oem FE 20's which are a popular choice, but the LM's will look just excellent.

http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g271/robdsavage/S8Bingley_zps7bb94df0.jpg

[The_Laird]

The 20" final edition wheels are, indeed a popular choice. Mine has them too (and 18" Avus wheels in the winter). Be prepared for a slightly harsher ride, but better handling, and improved looks IMHO!

[tintin]

Can't beat OEM 20's (but I'm biased too!) - a sure sign that summer's coming +++

[HPsauce]

The 20" final edition wheels are, indeed a popular choice. Mine has them too (and 18" Avus wheels in the winter). Same here, as of today. :D

[Borys]

My d3 on 20: bbs lm's

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[ainarssems]

They are nice alloys but in my opinion they do not suit D2 much, a bit better on D3 but still would not be my choice. I think they are more suited to smaller cars. FE 20's are probably the best for D2, and I am not even biased as I have 19 Carlssons on mine

[MrHooky]

Welcome along Hooky.

Yep, 20's look just fine on a D2. Mine are oem FE 20's which are a popular choice, but the LM's will look just excellent.

http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g271/robdsavage/S8Bingley_zps7bb94df0.jpg

That looks absolutely stunning in Aqua Blue. Not seen that colour before. Wheels look spot on. Tempted to go FE 20s now. Could be slightly easier to maintain than an exposed polished lip too.

How easy are FE 20s to get hold of? Ideally would want OEM wheels and not a repro. Presumably you pay a fair bit extra though...?

Some pics of my car. Excuse the low quality, filthy and on my parents drive at the time...

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10429
10425
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10426
10427

[tintin]

Expect to pay anywhere from £600 to £1000 second hand, depending on condition of alloys/with or without decent rubber/diamond cut or refurb'ed. They also don't come along very often, so tend to get snapped up...

[Cornershop]

Excellent, I test drove that car , was in shepherds bush? Price had a yoyo attached to it :)

Good luck with, looked a nice example but was the first one I drove so I didn't buy it

Stick with 18"s imho

[HPsauce]

How easy are FE 20s to get hold of? Ideally would want OEM wheels and not a repro. Presumably you pay a fair bit extra though...?They appear occasionally, I just bought a set (of 5) from our sponsors.
No complaints about the price, but after getting a couple straightened and four refurbished (plus a DIY job on the spare) and four new Michelin tyres, fitting etc. it was probably over £1500 in total.
And they are now coated, not diamond-cut.

[MrHooky]

Excellent, I test drove that car , was in shepherds bush? Price had a yoyo attached to it :)

Good luck with, looked a nice example but was the first one I drove so I didn't buy it

Stick with 18"s imho

From Hammersmith, so right neck of the woods yes. I'd done a bit of research and had a go in my old neighbour's 2002 S8 which he picked up for less. Was a keen price but did have a good history file including £2k on gearbox recently and £1,500 on new discs and pads all round.

I bought the first I viewed but I was quite specific about spec. My TT was the first one I viewed and it's served me well for nearly 6 years touch wood...

There are some black FEs on eBay at the moment asking quite a keen price given I'd look to have them diamond cut. Might put in a cheeky offer...

[MrHooky]

Could someone also please tell me the OEM tyre size to go onto the 20" wheels? I'm getting mixed feedback online.

Presumably the wheels and tyre combo on the 20" wheels gives the same rolling circumference as on the 18" avus?

Thanks

[HPsauce]

The OEM (Final Edition) wheels take 255/35R20 tyres. I just fitted a set and they're fine. Overall about 1% bigger vs 18's.

The D3 20's are wider wheels than D2, just half an inch I think.

[MrHooky]

Great thanks for that.

I've managed to negotiate a set of FE 20" OEM wheels for £560 - does that sound reasonable?

They need stripping back and re diamond cutting which I'll get done for c.£360. Plus it'll be another £700 on tyres so all in it'll be c.£1,600.

Think I'm going to take the plunge...

[HPsauce]

Right ball-park probably, depending on condition. Is that four or five?
Are they all straight (the ones I got weren't) or is some straightening/welding likely?

You won't know if they can be diamond-cut until they're stripped back. :tuttut:

[Lloyd]

The forum sponsors had a set not to hat long ago but yes prepare to pay the dreaded scene tax on a set of FE's or indeed anything Audi related these days

[HPsauce]

I bought those. ;)

[MrHooky]

Right ball-park probably, depending on condition. Is that four or five?
Are they all straight (the ones I got weren't) or is some straightening/welding likely?

You won't know if they can be diamond-cut until they're stripped back. :tuttut:

It's for 4. I'll keep the current spare in situ despite being a misfit. Chap said they're all straight. They're the black ones currently on eBay being listed at £770.

Didn't know that about the diamond cutting, presumed it was a finish that could be applied to all wheels.

I've countered the chap with £525. I'm in two minds at the moment. My current 18" Avus need a refurb. They're utterly horrid. A refurb of those is going to cost c.£240. Plus they need new tyres at £400 for some Pzero Rossos. The 20" wheels are looking at c.£900 for the rims all in refurbed plus £750 for the rubber.

Can I really justify the £1k extra for the 20s? Decisions decisions...

[Cornershop]

My thinking is this (happy to get shot down :) ) - Audi never developed the d2 to run 20" wheels, it was only in the final year(s) that 20" became available albeit with a control arm change and maybe other changes (?)

Appreciate they add a bling factor but most suspension specialists would never condone a '+2' jump in wheel diameter with basically the same underpinnings - a jump to 19" maybe (+1) at most.

I'm in the same boat, my Avus need a refurb hence I'm looking for a spare set of 18s and get new tyres fitted too.

I'm new here and I've had a couple of glasses of wine so this could be absolute twaddle :)

[HPsauce]

I'm looking for a spare set of 18sWhich I have as noted in another thread, 5 * PF Avus with 4 centre caps.

http://forum.a8parts.co.uk/attachment.php?attachmentid=10411&d=1427662196

[sarg]

Can I really justify the £1k extra for the 20s? Decisions decisions...

Yes! +++

[HPsauce]

Yes! +++

I managed to break mine down until it (almost) went away............. :ROFL:
New wheels needed refurbishing - but so (to some extent) do the ones I will sell, so I was committed to much of that spend.
New wheels need paying for - the old ones will sell for a fair price as they are sought after (by certain groups of drivers).
New wheels (2 of) needed straightening - but the old ones are true so have more value as a result.
New tyres needed - but the old ones were close to replacement, though 2 near-new will be sold as part-worn (OK, bit of a loss).
Time, cost and effort to swap - combined with winter/summer swap by my tyre man so minimal. Took him about an hour longer than normal.

Man logic. :cool:

[tintin]

It's for 4. The 20" wheels are looking at c.£900 for the rims all in refurbed plus £750 for the rubber.


That sounds like a lot to me: I picked up a mint (newly refurbed) set of five 20" FE wheels shod with very good Dunlops for a total of £700 all in - though I was probably a bit lucky, and wasn't in a rush to buy :D

[MrHooky]

My thinking is this (happy to get shot down :) ) - Audi never developed the d2 to run 20" wheels, it was only in the final year(s) that 20" became available albeit with a control arm change and maybe other changes (?)

Appreciate they add a bling factor but most suspension specialists would never condone a '+2' jump in wheel diameter with basically the same underpinnings - a jump to 19" maybe (+1) at most.

I'm in the same boat, my Avus need a refurb hence I'm looking for a spare set of 18s and get new tyres fitted too.

I'm new here and I've had a couple of glasses of wine so this could be absolute twaddle :)

I do like this thinking. Never really thought of the wheel size suspension impact. I assume the 20" are heavier but wouldn't have thought it would make much difference to the dynamics other than stiffer side wall so less roll. The rolling circumference is only supposed to be 1% difference to don't think much difference there...

I was now thinking that a pristine set of Avus and some good rubber would look almost as good as the FE 20" wheels. Personally I actually prefer the design of the Avus vs. the FE although I do think it looks a little under-wheeled given the size of the car. My 8N TT runs 18s and it's a tiny car in comparison.

Actually thinking a 19" Avus would be my ideal wheel...!

I also like the man Maths applied above. I'd sell the Avus and just run on the 20s all year round.

Think I need a drink to help me make a decision. I'm crap at this...!

[MrHooky]

That sounds like a lot to me: I picked up a mint (newly refurbed) set of five 20" FE wheels shod with very good Dunlops for a total of £700 all in - though I was probably a bit lucky, and wasn't in a rush to buy :D

That sounds a bargain given the tyres included. Given the rubber needed on these each new tyre is looking at least £175 which can't be ignored.

I've left an offer of £525 on the table for the wheels. Getting painted (instead of diamond cut) would be c.£60 per wheel so would be c.£760 all in pre rubber.

All sounding pricey for the bling factor...

[tintin]

Which I have as noted in another thread, 5 * PF Avus with 4 centre caps.

http://forum.a8parts.co.uk/attachment.php?attachmentid=10411&d=1427662196

I may be interested in these, if they're still available, 'cos I'm considering a change from my 18" 9 spokes (which would then be for sale…;) )

[tintin]

My thinking is this (happy to get shot down :) ) - Audi never developed the d2 to run 20" wheels, it was only in the final year(s) that 20" became available albeit with a control arm change and maybe other changes (?)

Appreciate they add a bling factor but most suspension specialists would never condone a '+2' jump in wheel diameter with basically the same underpinnings - a jump to 19" maybe (+1) at most.

I'm in the same boat, my Avus need a refurb hence I'm looking for a spare set of 18s and get new tyres fitted too.

I'm new here and I've had a couple of glasses of wine so this could be absolute twaddle :)

I don't buy this argument, at least from a driving experience perspective. Although I can't comment from a technical perspective in terms of the suspension components, I can from a user perspective, as I run both 18's (over the winter), and 20's (during the summer), so can comment on both, and I greatly prefer the performance of the 20's.

In my opinion the ride on 20's is firmer, and the handling and steering feels sharper: I'm really pleased to have just changed back to 20s, as the ride with the 18's felt just a bit wallowy. But I suppose it depends what kind of ride you prefer.

[The_Laird]

^^^^^^^
Wot he said!

I'm just the same; 18" wheels in winter and 20" in summer. The car does feel better on 20" wheels.

[Conquistador]

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Audi-Avus-wheels-18-audi-s4-s8-s6-/281647351427?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item41937d8683

[HPsauce]

Which are presumably what MrHooky has at present....... :Confused: Might suit Cornershop though.

[Cornershop]

Might suit Cornershop though.in my watch list...

I've discovered a place nearby that does wheel exchange - if they're not in stock, they will fit loan wheels for free and refurb your own. Visiting them on Saturday to see what's what and check the quality of the finish of the exchange wheels they offer.

[MrHooky]

Which are presumably what MrHooky has at present....... :Confused: Might suit Cornershop though.

Indeed they are. Look good refurbed to fair - mine are an absolute state. Blistered and scratched horrendously.

The Avus is a fine looking wheel just a bit small for the S8 IMO. Especially in 2015 where a MK7 golf GTI on 18s looks too small...

[MrHooky]

in my watch list...

I've discovered a place nearby that does wheel exchange - if they're not in stock, they will fit loan wheels for free and refurb your own. Visiting them on Saturday to see what's what and check the quality of the finish of the exchange wheels they offer.

Where are you based? I've used Rimfurbish in the West Mids who do the same. They're a division of Rimstock who make many OEM wheels and Team Dynamics rims. Very good finish and great service. Took a while to get the wheels done but only because they were busy which I didn't mind - tends to mean they're good...

[Cornershop]

Where are you based? I've used Rimfurbish in the West Mids who do the same. They're a division of Rimstock who make many OEM wheels and Team Dynamics rims. Very good finish and great service. Took a while to get the wheels done but only because they were busy which I didn't mind - tends to mean they're good...North London but I'm sorted now, just gotta get some tyres fitted.

http://forum.a8parts.co.uk/showthread.php?t=9783