Ceramic brake retrofit need a bit of help please
 

I am investigating fitting the S8 abs unit so that I can retain the wet weather pad wipe function, but of course i need the ceramic abs unit. Can anyone help me with a part number please?

Part number for the S8 is 4E0614517CB or superseded with 4E0614517CS. However, I can't find anything that designates one specifically for ceramics.

Maybe someone with ceramics can post their ABS part number.

Have you checked coding options? In most models the ABS unit is coded to whatever the brake setup is.

Following up on what MJ said, check out the following thread of someone doing a similar retrofit. If making coding changes, be sure to note down the current setting first:

https://forums.ross-tech.com/index.php?threads/32895/

Alas that thread does imply there is a different module for it since it seems the A8 module wouldn't accept the coding for the S8. Still, at least we learned it doesn't work :D

Just re-read that thread and also double-checked ETKA. In that thread, his unit had a BC suffix, which I initially thought was a typo, so I checked their log file and it is correct.

Checked ETKA and the 4.2 tdi (had to scan through Julian's other threads) could have had CQ, CB or CS suffixes, so worth a punt at least. Be interesting to hear the outcome.

Ahhh thanks for this guys I’ll read your posts carefully. I’m collecting the brakes next week.

This car is actually a 2006 3.0 tdi Swb. I bought the 4.2, had it a week and my dad fell in love with it so I gave it to him and bought this 3 litre for me.

Ok so I found a 4E0614517CS - I don’t have any coding experience, but I have VCDS and I’m reasonably handy generally with a computer. Does anyone know the procedure for coding this up if I fit it? Amazingly this D3 3.0 has a completely clean scan right now (!) so I don’t want to **** it up!

That link I provided in post #4 above goes into the coding side of things. Reading through it, the possible issues are the initial login code (do you use your existing code or what the new code is), and also running the Basic Settings to get the code to stick.

In terms of your car, and the image in the third post on that thread, I think your new code should be 05727 i.e. A8 SWB, Brembo, 6 Cyl Diesel with Brembo, Automatic. There is also a Note at the bottom of it to recode the Control Module.

As before, it will makes things easier in the future if you update your signature to include details of the car, so that we know exactly the spec, and don't have to keep asking specifics. Keep up informed on how it goes, and even provide a write-up of the procedure, as it might help someone at some point.

Mine as ACC which could be a factor. My ABS unit has Hardware 4E0 614 517 BT and Software 4E0 910 517 K and has ACC. It did seem to be a rarer part number when I looked for one a few years back

Thanks guys I have edited my signature to include the two Audis, thanks for the tip.

So, a question - when I log on to the brake module am I logging on as the car is NOW, and then trying to code what I want it to be once I’m “in” ?

Just to let you know the abs unit will not accept any other coding except for how the car came out of the factory, it only accepts one coding value! So you cannot recode it for Brembo M6 AL calipers. If you want ceramics you'll have to have the correct abs unit.

To be honest it's best not to mess with the abs as it's known to register an 'ABS control module defective' fault, even though it functions properly.

That’s really helpful thanks. I did mess with it tonight before I read your warning so hopefully I haven’t cocked it up. It seems you’re exactly right though. I can log in to the module using the correct code (for my car 05457) as it has the standard little PR-1LG brakes coded, but from there it won’t accept anything in the soft coding section to do with Brembo brakes.

I'm sure it's fine... and stay away from performing any output tests on the abs.

There is a specific sequence of tasks when coding the ABS, as demonstrated in the following video. Is this the same sequence you followed, bearing in mind that the codes you need will be different, as the video use an A4? If you have, that will at least confirm what matty mentioned:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G7YRiVYrLjo

Thanks guys. The car is fine thankfully. So I had watched the video and that’s how I was attacking it. The problem is that you can’t get the module to accept the login for anything that has ceramic brakes. It accepts the login for two types of steel brakes, but as soon as you code ceramic it doesn’t like it.

I think that it doesn’t like the idea of changing the “car type” from diesel without ceramics to the more general one.

I might buy an S8 module to play with as it would be nice to complete the job comprehensively.

I wonder if I can trouble you guys again for a bit of urgent help? I’ve travelled a long way to collect my ceramic brake kit but on inspection the front drivers disc is damaged. It is part 4E0615302C. I have found a 4E0615302E drivers disc on eBay at a reasonable price. Will this work for me? Thanks, J

Looking up ETKA for 4E0615302C I get the following information. The first thing displayed is a remark stating 'Caution: Mixed installation of brake discs not permitted.' Now I have no idea what exactly that means, whether it means mixing steel with ceramic or mixing different ceramic ones.

The replacement part numbers are 4E0615302F, followed by 4E0615302G and finally 4E0615302H. I couldn't find 4E0615302E anywhere in the entire A8/S8 range or entire Audi range, so searched under dropped parts and found it there, and it shows with it being replaced with F, G and H. In theory is should be fine, as all superseded versions are the same.

That’s brilliant thankyou. I brought the kit back today so I now have three good discs and one gouged one, plus the four calipers. We did a deal on the abs module and disc backings too so those should be in the post when he takes them off the written off S8 over the weekend. The single replacement disc should be on its way too next week so then I can spend a bit of time cleaning it all up and take a look at the condition of all the seals and hardware.

I can’t imagine that having the two “unmatched” discs will be a problem. It’s interesting that each disc has its production weight etched into the bell, and they are a considerable amount different even across the “matched” pair.

Can I ask how much the complete kit cost? You can PM if you don't want to post it here...just curious.

In the (hopefully loooong) future the discs will need replacing and I've looked at a couple of options which doesn't include Audi as they more than doubled the price to around 4K per disc if I remember correctly!

Julian - have you got all the info on how Audi recommend inspecting/weighing the discs to ensure they're serviceable?

I imagine it's in one of the tech dump files, but if not I can probably find it in ElsaWin

Evening gentlemen, hope we are all having a good weekend.

So I bought the four calipers, discs, backings and abs unit for £2000 and then I’ve had to pay £500 for the replacement disc.

I have noticed that Rebrake and Redisc both offer services to recondition discs, at around £1600 per disc. I don’t think they could necessarily sort out my damaged one though as it’s pretty heavily gouged in the middle. So I’m going to run the discs and see what they’re like. Later, if needed, I’m prepared to send them away to be fettled.

My thinking - could be totally wrong - is that I think it’s pretty unlikely that the rears will have been put under any significant load with the D3 S8 being all nose. Also, since we have speed limits here I can’t see the brakes having being exposed to too many 150mph stops, and I don’t expect an S8 to have too many track miles under its belt either, which is where CCB’s are known to wear significantly faster than one would like. So hopefully they should be in reasonable shape - they certainly look it. Obviously I haven’t received the fourth disc yet but that’s reputed to be very low mileage.

It would be great to get the info on wear checking, so I can verify the position before we begin.

I’ve obtained some forged wheels too which when combined with these brakes should lower the unsprung and rotating mass nicely…

Check out the following PDF from the D3 Tech Dump thread:

17-Service Manual Brake system.pdf

Technical info at the start and details for fitting them in other section.

Super helpful thanks - I’m well within tolerances from every perspective so looking good. Calipers need a good bit of attention as they look like something that came up with the titanic at the moment. (See pic)

What I can’t work out is why they say not to detach the alloy centre. As soon as I read that I obviously detached it on my “spare” disc to see what the fuss is about. I tested the torque on the fasteners before I undid them - 6nm to move the nuts so I reckon 5nm tightening torque, and the alloy bell auto centres due to the sliders. I was considering putting the discs in my ultrasonic cleaner but I need to work out what solution to use. I’m guessing something gently alkaline.

They don't look too bad. A full refurb (seals and paint) and a new set of the springs/shims will make them new. The shims are still available from Audi/TPS for around £70 a set

Great - can I get seal kits for them do you think?

Also, it seems that the original seller isn’t a man of his word and has let me down on the abs unit and the 4 disc guards. Can anyone here help me with the part numbers for the 4 guards? I know the abs unit, obviously. Very frustrating.

Front left - 4E0615311L or 4E0615311M
Front right - 4E0615312L or 4E0615312M
Rear left - 4E0615611G
Rear right - 4E0615612G

Ahh thanks you’re an absolute legend.

Hmm these seem to be unobtainium. I’m wondering if the parts off the w12 might be usable as that had big discs? What do you think guys? And if so what about part numbers on those?

Can't give you an answer, but I can give you the part numbers and figures. I've attached images of the ceramic disks and steel disks. Don't know if these are 100% accurate, but in the image of the front ceramics, the guard appears to have like a large lip at the end.

The front ceramics are 380mm, the steel ones are either 360mm or 385mm. Part numbers for the larger front guards are 4E0615311H (left) and 4E0615312H (right).

The rear ceramics are 356mm, the steel ones all use the same part number regardless of size. Part numbers are 4E4615611A (left) and 4E4615612A (right).

Having written all that, I just decided to check out a site I've used before and they are showing all the four guards for the ceramics listed in my previous post. Some parts are listed as 'special procurement Audi Tradition' but I think it only shows up during the checkout process:

https://originalteilemarkt.de/

Thank you that’s great. Turns out the seller of the ceramics was not honourable and has gone quiet now it’s time to send me the abs unit and disc guards. Some people really are the pits. So, I think I will just bite the bullet and order the new correct disc guards and look out for a well priced abs unit at some point. Will strip the calipers this weekend and send the rusty bits for powder - hopefully the bleed screws will come out nicely. They look pretty welded in!