HELP: steering rack
 

Guys, I need your advice or some info.

Looks like I need a new steering rack.

After about 40min of driving or 20-30min in standstill traffic (when engine is up to it's full temp so the suspension/steering because of all that heat) you can hear really annoying squeaking noise just in the corners , bottom of the windscreen.
Not so noticeable when driving 50mph+. Other than that, almost every little bump, even in a standstill when turning the wheels, or when driving veeeery slowly on uneven road.

Are they repairable without full recon?? (take out, change worn out/squeaky ends, put it back)
How much does the new one costs??
Is it worth buying a low mileage one (will need to really be assured its a low milage)??

Does it really takes 4-5 hours to change it??

How about reconditioning?? It still costs around 300 but not having a car for a week is something I don't like at all

What guys do you know about this issue on D3s??

Any info grately appreciated as always
:cheers:

More likely that the fault lies within bushes or ball joints. As for the steering rack change 4-5 hours seem a bit optimistic, I would say a full days job.

Don't know about the D3, but I think the recommended labour charge for the D2 is 7 hours (it should be more like 17 hours!) - it took me about 4-5 weekends to do mine, it's a b1tch of a job.

However, your symptoms don't sound like a steering rack to me, the most obvious symptom of a worn out rack is usually when it starts dropping all the PAS fluid

Sounds more like control arms/joints

Though, my D2 was making some scary noises, thought I was going to need a new rack, and checked the fluid levels, to find that the inline filter in the reservoir was clogged, quick clean and no more noises, must have been causing the pump to cavitate.

Sure it's not one of the many suspension arms?

Cheers guys +++
I've had upper suspension arms changed just over a year ago.
My guys checked all upper arms and there was no visible damage at all.
It gets noisy ONLY when its hot/warmed up by the engine's hot air which fills in wheel arches if you know what I mean.
I will get some pictures in next hour.

When it gets up to temp its really loud, very loud, inside and outside.
I will go to Morrisons now and try to warm up the car and record the sound as well

I'll be back soon

So....got all the possible info for you guys.
'My guys' are either blind or...whatever, but as my Audi garage is over 30miles across London (approx 2h drive one way) its quiet difficult and time consuming to go there each time I have a question, any way...

Lets start from the noise
After around half an hour of running the engine in standstill this is what's happening
Please turn the volume up to max

INSIDE, phone placed by the tax disc just in the bottom left corner of the windscreen
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yw5G...ature=youtu.be

OUTSIDE, phone placed on top of the tyre (left)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_JtJ...ature=youtu.be

Now, I'M SORRY IF THAT'S WAY TO MANY PICTURES, most of them might not be relevant as the damage is clear on the upper suspension arms, but I am not a mechanic so just want you to have a look at other joint, which to me look fine.

The one with smaller cracks is much quieter AND it needs another 15-20min to start making this horrible noise.

BUT the real question is: Are this cracks the possible source of that horrible noise, it just sounds unreal for something so minor to cause such a LOUD noise????
And why it's completely silent when cold??

[IMG]http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/...3/DSC_1941.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/...3/DSC_1943.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/...3/DSC_1944.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/...3/DSC_1946.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/...3/DSC_1947.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/...3/DSC_1949.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/...3/DSC_1950.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/...3/DSC_1953.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/...3/DSC_1954.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/...3/DSC_1959.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/...3/DSC_1964.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/...3/DSC_1965.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/...3/DSC_1968.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/...3/DSC_1969.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/...3/DSC_1970.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/...3/DSC_1971.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/...3/DSC_1972.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/...3/DSC_1973.jpg[/IMG]

I had the same problem around december and changed all 4 upper arms with OE TRW arms from http://www.mister-auto.co.uk/en/ as they had TRW and were a great price. I still had a bit of a creak and a rattle that got worse, so did the lower arms, which felt great but noise still there, so took to Audi who diagnosed antirollbar and changed that, car drive like like new, beautiful.

If you do the arms yourself, get the proper instructions from ELSAWIN software and check the heights of the arms when you tighten the bolts, they should be way up in the wheel arch and then you have to wrestle to insert them into the hub carrier. Many garages just tighten the nuts with the suspension on full droop, so the bushes are all twisted up when at normal driving height.

Hmmmm...OK, so more likely not a steering rack?

How does the TRW compares to Audi part?? I know that some aftermarket one can last not even a year, TRW rings the bell as a high quality replacement??

To repeat my question, would this cracked rubber cause sooooomuch noise when it's warm/hot???

Am I write that two upper arms needs changing (one on each side)
them two
right one
Thats the one??
http://www.mister-auto.co.uk/en/susp...61JTC1139.html
http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/...3/DSC_1972.jpg
...and left one
That's the one??
http://www.mister-auto.co.uk/en/susp...61JTC1138.html
http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/...3/DSC_1970.jpg

Is that a bloody great crack on photo 11

Fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu*k, I think u r bloody right

As well as the crack, the bushes appear shot too. If there is that much surface cracking then the rubber has lost all its flexibility.

Might also be worth checking the track rod ends, I had them replaced on the D2 due to strange sounds when turning which was originally put down to the steering. They looked fine from the outside but the ball joints had seen better days.

The originals are TRW, and the aftermarket ones have the part number cast, but the VW/Audi logo ground off.

Not sure if it's cracked or just a sharp shadow caused by the flash, but worth checking.

The bushes are definitely shot though :)

Great stuff guys.
And will check that crack shortly as its very interesting.

I'll go for TRW then

One question which still does bother me. Have you listen the sound guys? If yes, is that sort of sound you would expect from bushes when they are cracked as mine BUT ONLY when they get hot?????

Is thats what I need??
http://www.mister-auto.co.uk/en/susp...61JTC1139.html

http://www.mister-auto.co.uk/en/susp...61JTC1138.html

Plus, how hard is to change them other than having car at the right height when doing the bolts up??
Does car need to be jacked up or on the ramp??
I heard that some of them long bolts can be a real pain.

I think I will have to replace all 4 upper ones, will try to jack it up today and take a proper look.

Marcin, listening to the sound its exactly the same as my old D2 and the sound turned out to the be track rods ends as I mentioned a couple of posts ago. The bush in photo 11 is dead but I would have expected a clonking sound from that rather than the audible groan.

The noise sounds like something dry getting rotated, mountings at top of strut possibly? Either way the arms need doing as the bushes are shot and when your in there pulling it all apart check everything else.

Sound is pretty much like dry ball joint. Try to clean them up on outside so that dirt does not get in, peel back rubber boot a bit, spray some grease/oil in there and see if noise goes away. If it does you know where it's coming from but to sort them out properly would need to clean old grease out and pack with new grease if there is no wear in them or replace if too much wear.

Bushes does not look good but I would not say that they are shot. As long as there is no excessive movement they should be fine. 2-3 year old bushes can look like that but last for another 7 years before needing replacement.

Dry ball joint sounds good as the wife's X5 has started making a similar noise the last day or two! Hopefully a cheap fix.

Personally I would be replacing all arms and joints at the front.

Youre going to be taking them all apart to replace one or two. might as well take them all out and do them all now rather than staggering them all over the next several months.

I'd also recommend Meyle HD arms if you can get them. Cost slightly more but comes with 5 years guarantee and are amazing when fitted.

So....at this point I'm planning to replace all the necessary bits, upper arms, possibly track rods ends. For sure all the arms with shot bushes.

Which ones are the ball joint so I can see if it is a dry joint?? Is it characteristics for them to become noise only after they get hot??

Looked quickly at the Meyle parts and you can get them +++

I assume TRW offers just 1 year warranty.
4 year warranty for extra few quid sounds like a no brainer, or it's just a marketing trick?? Extra few quid for 4 times longer warranty, seems a bit to good to be true...

I don't really know how good they are at honouring their warranty cause I've never known anyone need to claim on it.

I got a set fitted to my A4 that's 3 years old and 50k miles old and still going strong.

guys, im trying to price the parts and labour to have it done before the annual meet, last thing im missing, last puzzle, to actually attend this year, without that I may not be able at all.

whic ball joint you are talking about

is it a ball joint for the video provided??

what are the chance that lower arms are not in need of changing, they are massive and pricey but you cant see the rubber bits on the end by the engine because of the way they are mounted, so frustrating when you know nothing about mechanical side and garage is 36miles across london

im on mister auto as suggested looking at TRW parts only and there is so much i could change is shocking.

As mentioned earlier car will have re-spray done next week 90%, wheels refurb even this weekend, gearbox at mackies on friday morning, 6th of june, 1st day of meet, and that noise is the missing puzzle

THANK YOU !!!!!!!!!

Sounds a bit out of the norm but if your looking to replace ball joints anyway, how about a syringe full of gear oil and inject it through the boot into ball joint to see if the squeaking goes away and if it does you know what needs changing.

An experienced mot tester should be able to tell you which joints have wear so if you know one locally try that as a first point of call Marcin, just ask their advice +++

Cheers boys

Do you actually lift the protective rubber and just stick some gear oil in there, because it looks like it's fixed and don't want to tear it or whatever.
Told you I'm not mechanically minded, but I will eventually, its all about experience ;) ...and knowledge as well and I'm missing both

They normally have a wire clip around them at the top and while compressed i.e. fitted to the car you'll not have much room to move the rubber anywhere. MOT tester would put a bar (something like this)
http://forum.a8parts.co.uk/attachmen...1&d=1399562365
between the arm and the part the arm locates into and will apply pressure so see how much it moves, it is then his discretion as to how much is excessive movement.

So how about that dry ball joint which you guys suspect, tools will determine any movement, but that weird noise isn't cause by worn out ball joint but dry ball joint or I'm just getting confused here??
Would excessive movement caused this sound but ONLY when warmed up, remember guys, it happens only after 40min of driving when everything is up to the temp, gets worst around city when most of driving is at low speeds or in standstill in traffic so all the heat from underneath the engine but no much cooling.

THANK YOU

yes the rubber is clipped on thats why I mentioned sticking a needle through it and inject some oil inside.

TBH I have never done it, always been really obvious when i have changed ball joints in the past.

Like has been said earlier best thing is to get her on a ramp at test centre when shes hot and squeaky and they can get the plate shaker to giggle the front end around and advise whats needing done.

I would only take minutes to do so you may get away with with paying them a few beer tokens

Cheers guys :cheers:

If I would like to change all the ball joints I would have to change every single arm as they all have one :mad:

Do the lower front arms go wear a much as the upper one which from what I've noticed they need changing more often.

How about the link stabilizers?? could that make the noise?? I may regret that question, but hey, I'm thick :p

If the noise is very loud through the steering wheel it could also be the tie rod ends rather than the track rod ends, as they would give more noise through the steering

:cheers:+++

I was thinking about that originally as noise is very sensitive to steering, if thats what it is than it's cheap as chips, not 800 as I planned, but will want to have all the arms checked before the trip, some obviously will need changing soon due to the cracks, I may visit MOT center tomorrow morning before dropping car off for wheel refurb

UPDATE

4x upper arms to start with.

I think I asked it before.
TRW or Meyle HD guys?? or any other.

Got upper arms 18months ago from GSF stupidly and there you go, year and a half and they need changing again :angry4:

I think Psyche mentioned that TRW do upper arms for Audi!?

I would always use Lemforder or Meyle personally +++

OK, cheers Neil +++

Thats
- 2 votes for Meyle HD
- 1 vote TRW
- 1 vote Lemforder

Interesting and confusing :rolleyes:

- 3 votes for Meyle HD
- 1 vote TRW
- 2 vote Lemforder

Just been told by Euro Car Parts guy that Lemforder is the closest to OEM from all of them as they do OEM parts for Audi, Merc etc.

Now, I think Psyche mentioned that TRW does the OEM arms for Audi (as well??)

4x upper arms:
- TRW around £215
- Lemforder
- ECP £305
- Mister Auto £235
- Meyle HD, awaiting price from Car Parts Center.

Still confused to which one choose, but now I'm slightly changing my focus from TRW towards Lemforder.

I've always seen Lemforder as the OEM manufacturer for Audi, and have theirs fitted to my D2, they also guarantee their parts for a longer period than the cheap stuff. I've just bought a pair of upper rear arms and tie rod ends for mine and they are all Lemforder. +++

Looks like I'll be ordering 4x Lemforder upper arms this weekend from Mister Auto

Cheers guys +++