D5 is a bit clever

[roberto]

D5 is very tempting now with prices down close to £25k
its the spec i cant get my head around atm (what is std and what options are best to have)
but i really fancy this one albeit over priced

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Audi-A8-3...h/154113461871

[Adrian E]

Specs following the changes to emissions testing are quite challenging to fathom - to avoid having to do more tests, manufacturers have tended to produce cars to a range of option specs without giving new purchasers the choice to pick and choose the ones they want

Basically it'll most likely be poverty spec, or with a fairly random choice of options you may or may not want

[Conan_the_Librarian]

I bought my first S8 as a 10yo at 1/7 of its sale price. Looking forward to 2030!

[tintin]

Originally Posted by Conan_the_Librarian

I bought my first S8 as a 10yo at 1/7 of its sale price. Looking forward to 2030!

That means you're twice as frugal as I was

[HPsauce]

I was up at about 1/3rd of list price and 3 years old.
But then I'd been searching for one for ages and the price/availability curve just got close enough for me to bite the bullet.

[J i m s t e r]

Originally Posted by Conan_the_Librarian

I bought my first S8 as a 10yo at 1/7 of its sale price. Looking forward to 2030!

Wonder how long fossil fuel infrastructure will be around for, after 2030? I mean, you'd expect another ten years, for people buying a new fossil fuel car in 2029.

I hope electric cars get longer-lasting batteries, because I can't afford a new one and I wonder when buying a ten year old EV, if the battery will be performing at reduced capacity once ten years old.

Maybe 2030 battery tech will be good for 20 years by then.

[ainarssems]

Originally Posted by J i m s t e r

Wonder how long fossil fuel infrastructure will be around for, after 2030? I mean, you'd expect another ten years, for people buying a new fossil fuel car in 2029.

I hope electric cars get longer-lasting batteries, because I can't afford a new one and I wonder when buying a ten year old EV, if the battery will be performing at reduced capacity once ten years old.

Maybe 2030 battery tech will be good for 20 years by then.

We think a lot alike


Battery life is more about discharge cycles than years you would expect 500-1000 discharge cycles before capacity drops to 50% on older batteries, newer should be better but obviously they have not been around long enough to know for sure.

24kWh Nissan Leaf battery is about 50%capacity after 100k miles, Tesla Model S being bigger car uses a bit more electricity but I don't think the difference is huge so say 70kWh is almost 3 times larger so could do 3 times as many miles for the same number of discharge cycles or 100kWh battery 4 times more and Teslas batteries may be better, lasting more cycles.

[roberto]

off topic now but

electric is not the answer

lithium Will run out before oil

and i will run out of life before the end of derv

you young guns will end up with billions of tons of nuclear waste and waste batteries

[J i m s t e r]

They'll have some next-gen battery stuff creeping out of the labs once they have got return on the investment they made to make all the lithium and cobalt batteries. Then there is the tin-foil-hat-wearer in me that watched "Tucker" (not Jenkins; the car man) and think the best tech has been buried next to the Ark of the Covenant for make benefit Illuminati etc.

But re: nuclear waste etc - maybe one of these solutions could be the next big thing. :

https://www.pocket-lint.com/gadgets/...r-over-the-air

Article mentions foldable batteries. Maybe they could make the shell/body parts actual lightweight batteries to get the mass down = increase efficiency.

But still wondering about grid capacity at the generating end of the line... Maybe we should ask a D5, they do seem jolly clever sorts.

[tintin]

Originally Posted by J i m s t e r

Wonder how long fossil fuel infrastructure will be around for, after 2030? I mean, you'd expect another ten years, for people buying a new fossil fuel car in 2029.

I hope electric cars get longer-lasting batteries, because I can't afford a new one and I wonder when buying a ten year old EV, if the battery will be performing at reduced capacity once ten years old.

Maybe 2030 battery tech will be good for 20 years by then.

The tipping point has already passed for ICE/EV transition, and will continue to accelerate. Buying most new fossil cars - other than a cheap disposable one - anytime from 2025 onwards would be financial lunacy, as the resale value will be close to zero, unless it's a high value specialist vehicle (e.g. a Ferrari).
Even buyers of those specialist types of ICE cars will be faced with significantly higher running costs due to dwindling infrastructure and the resultant high costs of maintaining such a network, so between now and 2025 ICE car ownership will quickly become a "niche" pastime.

Also the "battery capacity" point is a bit of a smokescreen and irrelevant: anyone who uses this argument should ask themselves whether the performance of their 10 year old ICE engine is as good as when it was new, as that's the equivalent comparator - except that the EV battery can (and does) get recycled and used elsewhere once their useful vehicle life has finished, not scrapped like a combustion engine does.

It's also worth thinking about relative depreciation on ICE cars and EVs. Here's some figures that might give pause for though (S8 vs Model S, assuming same purchase price, kept for 5 years, doing 20k per annum - i.e. my usage history). I ran this data through this (US...) website https://caredge.com/depreciation for 2 scenarios: (1) buying new, and (2) buying a 5 year old car, and the results are a bit interesting:

(A) NEW PURCHASE - S8 vs MODEL S:

• An Audi S8 will depreciate 65% after 5 years and have a 5 year resale value of $21,335.
• A Tesla Model S will depreciate 51% after 5 years and have a 5 year resale value of $34,700.

(B) BUYING A 5 YEAR OLD S8 vs MODEL S:

• An Audi S8 will depreciate a further 35% from years 6 to 10 years and have a 10 year resale value of $459
• A Tesla Model S will depreciate a further 30% from years 6 to 10 and have a 10 year resale value of $5,333.

For these reasons, I can't see why anyone would consider shelling out significant (i.e. >£10k) amounts of cash on any "premium" or large ICE vehicle from this point onwards. But others may disagree...