Brexit - The Poll

[HPsauce]

Originally Posted by moltuae

I did hear one compelling argument for leaving Europe though, and that was this: If we had never been part of the EU, considering the state Europe is in at present, would you be voting to join?

BUT, and it's a very big but, where would we be now if we weren't in? It's a meaningless question, and really just a con. Definitely not an argument for anything

I was a voter (and worker) in 1973 when we joined the then EC and (think I) remember what it was like. No-one can work out what the UK would be like now if we'd stayed out for those 43 years.

Unless you believe this Daily Fail article and can "hop across" to check: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencete...ry-claims.html

[Goran]

Originally Posted by snapdragon

Sorry to say, it will be rigged to remain by postal vote stuffing.
George Soros's Purpose dot org already have operatives poised.
Blind-eyes will be turned to broken ballot box seals as has been the case for 20 years.

Sorry to sound like a conspiracy theorist, but I have to agree. Its going to go whichever way 'they' want it to go. They already decided in advance what they want to happen. I can't believe for a second they would leave such an important decision up to us ordinary people.
I think the public vote is just for show to make us think we really have a say.

[steamship]

Originally Posted by Goran

Sorry to sound like a conspiracy theorist, but I have to agree. Its going to go whichever way 'they' want it to go. They already decided in advance what they want to happen. I can't believe for a second they would leave such an important decision up to us ordinary people.
I think the public vote is just for show to make us think we really have a say.

Glad to see I'm not alone in my thinking here

In the end, we the populace don't matter, it's what those in power want that counts, and those people that turn to the media for 'information' have been attacked from both sides by all the scaremongering. I think someone else mentioned this on the forum, but this has never been done before, so absolutely no one knows what will happen. All we can do is make our own decisions on where to put the X, and then wait.

[ulfilias]

Delboy - Coming out over TTIP?!?!? The EU is curently blocking it and Cameron was one of the main Instigators of it. Somehow I bet it will be worse if left to Cameron

As for rigging....I'm not sure.
I don't quite get why the Torys gave us the refurendum in the first place. Yes it's in the manifesto, but so are a lot of things they haven't done!

Also why the Torys would predominantly be on the stay side. I would have thought without the EU to answer to they could nicely cut back rights and asset strip the country. I almost wonder if it's reverse psychology!

Also the most convincing argument for leave i've heard was from a very astute friend, yet i've not seen it anywhere else. He said the EU is very PRO EU and actually a bit anti WORLD. The £35K for ROTW migrants was brought in the ballence the numbers of cheap EU labour. If we brought in caps on EU labour we could reduce that and pick and choose!

Which kinda makes stay EUist and Leave a lot less racist than some of the far right would hope!

[oldnick]

Originally Posted by steamship

Glad to see I'm not alone in my thinking here

In the end, we the populace don't matter, it's what those in power want that counts, and those people that turn to the media for 'information' have been attacked from both sides by all the scaremongering. I think someone else mentioned this on the forum, but this has never been done before, so absolutely no one knows what will happen. All we can do is make our own decisions on where to put the X, and then wait.

have to disagree because 'they' are on both sides , are they not ?

and judging by the difficulties I had to get postal votes sent to my french address in time to vote the austrian problem won't arise

but maybe we will learn something from this poll ...the median age of members here is something about 45

[tonupkid]

I would be surprised if it was possible to get away with vote rigging on a scale sufficient to change things.
And to be honest the idea that who or what we vote for is really that important is a bit naive IMHO.
The real power in a country is exercised through the money supply, something over which we, and our successive governments, have absolutely zero control.

[ainarssems]

It seems to me that unless you're fully informed and aware of the implications, one way or the other (which most people aren't), you shouldn't be voting.

Nobody is fully informed or aware of all the implications. You do your best to gather information about the issues that concern you, do assessment of risks and benefits, make your choice and hope for the best like you do with many other things in your life be it partner choice, house, job or a car this being car forum just to mention a couple of things. Not voting is mostly for people who do not care or don't want to take responsibility for their actions and would rather blame others when the choice does not work out. It's nothing personal and I do understand that for some people personal circumstances can make it difficult but I still think everybody should put in effort and make a decision.

On another note if I understand it right it is only advisory referendum so it does not matter what public chooses , it's up to government to make a decision. I think the referendum result will be very close and probably remain will win but even if people vote to leave government will probably choose to remain but will be able to use large percentage of British people wanting to leave as a argument to negotiate better deals within EU. I think the whole point of this referendum was more about to show EU large percentage of British people not happy with current arrangements and not about actually leaving. And on top that I think it has been choreographed spectacle with some MP's and other high profile personalities jumping bandwagon to influence general public so that we just about vote to stay in.

[moltuae]

Originally Posted by ainarssems

Nobody is fully informed or aware of all the implications. You do your best to gather information about the issues that concern you, do assessment of risks and benefits, make your choice and hope for the best like you do with many other things in your life be it partner choice, house, job or a car this being car forum just to mention a couple of things.

I disagree. We're not talking about personal choices here, it's a decision that affects the entire nation. I think if you're going to vote on something like this you should be informed enough to be absolutely certain what the implications are, otherwise you might as well just toss a coin. Personally I'd rather leave the vote to those who are well informed; sadly I think those people will probably be vastly outnumbered by all the people who didn't understand the implications but chose to vote anyway, just because they felt they should.

[Johnmed]

Wowza. That surprised me. Not the result I wanted, nor the result the majority of parliament wanted. But that's democracy I guess.

[pete-p]

Interestingly, the poll here was pretty much spot on the actual result!

Just have to wait and see what happens next, it is only a slim majority in favour of leave.